What kind of society have we become.

[noel]

Drugs, gangs of hooligans terrorising peace loving people on housing estates. People scared to defend their homes against burglars incase they are sued for distressing them.
My wife went back to our son's first school last night, St.James' it used to be a rural area friendly, now the school is circled with barbed wire, thanks no doubt to some of the people who have been brought into the area from overspills. This morning we were hearing about a 11 year old boy who comitted suicide because of school bullies. What have we become, and how can we correct it? I'm not certain that policing in a helicopter keeps drugs off the streets, maybe a lot more bobbies on the beat would.
Militant Muslim Clerics probably getting state hand-outs preaching hatred of all things British.
I just feel so negative about the way Britain has gone in the last 30 years . Help me feel positive someone. Tell me Britain is a wonderful place to live in and I've got it wrong.

[William R]

Noel, me old mate, When I started reading your post I thought you`d been on a visit to Barnsley, and not looked me up.I agree with what you say, and apart from going ranting and raving round towm, there`s not al lot you can do.If you try to make a change here, you are at risk of finding someone putting something nasty through you letter box which warms the whole house up. So we grin and bear it and go tut tut.Reading your second post, points me in the right direction, I think. Cheerio. William R.

[noel]

quote:

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Originally posted by William R
Noel, me old mate, When I started reading your post I thought you`d been on a visit to Barnsley, and not looked me up.I agree with what you say, and apart from going ranting and raving round towm, there`s not al lot you can do.If you try to make a change here, you are at risk of finding someone putting something nasty through you letter box which warms the whole house up. So we grin and bear it and go tut tut.Reading your second post, points me in the right direction, I think. Cheerio. William R.

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I don'tthink we should grin and bear it Bill.I'm just glad that I for one live in a respectable neighbourhood.Just check this article out I copied from last night's LEP.There are CCTV cameras on almost every street corner in Fishwick – but the atmosphere is still uneasy.================================================Families are running the gauntlet every day as gangs of yobs like Mark Fitzgerald make their lives a misery.The police spent four months investigating the reasons for the estate's problems and that landed "midget" Mark Fitzgerald before magistrates.Today many of his victims, too scared to be named or quoted directly, told how Fitzgerald was a symbol of growing racial unrest on the estate.Residents saw the Evening Post report on Fitzgerald's anti social behaviour order and were delighted.One Asian man, whose identity we have agreed to protect for his family's sake, spoke of the problems caused by Fitzgerald and others like him.The young father said: "It's awful where I live."We get called racist names and spat at. They call me "Paki b******" and things like that."One man I know had eggs thrown at him as he walked to the mosque."I have to say I have lived here for 30 years and I get on with everybody. It's not me they target in particular, it's everybody."They all go for the older people or those much younger because they won't answer back."I would say a couple of times a week I am exposed to racism."He spoke of the abuse families faced on their way to the mosque and while they were inside."While we are praying in the mosque people come and open the door."You see we can't lock it because people are always coming in to pray, and they shout racial abuse while we are praying."It's not just the older youths, it's 12 or 13-year-olds, including girls. Don't get me wrong, there are bad lads in the Asian community too."The man said his wife was now too terrified to leave the house.He recalled one incident where she was in the kitchen and one of the gang of yobs climbed on to their roof. The man said the youth had even entered their house while his wife was inside.He said: "People don't want to get involved in case it causes more trouble in the community or for their particular family. My neighbours talk to me about it."Local people are scared of course they are. I'm pretty healthy and I can look after myself on a one-to-one basis but if there were three or four ganging up on you there's nothing you can do."He spoke of his young boys and how he had stopped them from playing in the streets.He said: "If my children are playing outside they get moved on by youths saying, 'you can't play here'."On one occasion my son was playing outside and he was pushed by a lad and told to move on."The man hopes that life will improve for the community now ASBOs are being brought in.He said: "We need more police, just checking on things like when the lads are hanging on street corners."I would like to see more foot patrols from police. I want somebody to go to the community and speak with them."Another resident, a young mum, described how she had been struck by footballs and spat at by the youths.
Her family has started driving the few hundred metres to the mosque because they are too scared to walk.
But there is hope for Fishwick and communities like them in Preston.
Just two days after the ASBO, families say they have noticed a difference. The estate is quieter.
Police have have been inundated with inquiries from people asking how to get ASBOs imposed on troublemakers in their areas.
PC Dave Johnson, who led the Fitzgerald investigation said: "I think it will encourage other people to report crimes to the police because they can now see something positive has been done.
"I think it will send out a warning message that that sort of behaviour will not be tolerated. We will actively pursue people committing racist crime and they will be dealt with accordingly."
Muslim leaders in Preston welcome the use of ASBOs – but only as a last resort.
Chairman of the Lancashire Council of Mosques, Ibby Master, said: "It's unfortunate that it's actually got to this stage where this order had to be put on him.
"It must have been a last resort from the magistrates' point of view and I hope the person learns from this.
"But I welcome the court's decision on this simply because racism is something nobody has to tolerate.
"We are a multi-cultural society where diversity is accepted and if people are not able to accept that they need some education and hopefully this order will educate him.
"Hopefully he will behave in a more acceptable manner. I am sure it has been done as a last resort. Some people have to be forced.
"It's sad from my point of view that this gentleman isn't able to learn and accept multi-culturalism.
"If he's putting other people's lives into misery and harassing other people racially then that is not acceptable because other people have the right to live a normal life.
"I would like people to be treated and educated in other people's cultures and what they stand for and that way it will break down barriers."
Farooq Kazi, of Preston Racial Equality Council, said: "We welcome the court's decision which is going to enhance and encourage good community relations. We must pay tribute to the police service and courts and others who worked so hard in harmony to give this strong clear message to a minority of criminals who are out there harming relations."
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Why should we let yobs like Fitzgerald ruin our way of life?

[LDunlop76]

Not everything is doom - I cherish the friendships I have made on this forum for instance - something we couldn't have done 30 years ago. But there is no doubt things have taken a down turn. The gap between rich and poor has widened. People feel more pressure to conform with expected levels of living - esp kids who are peer pressured into wanting logo'ed clothes, the latest mobile phones blah, blah. It creates a feeling of being owed something and for those who can't have, a resentment. Also the people who grew up in the liberalised 60's are today's parents. So we have lax standards of behaviour, lenient punishments - there's no incentive to behave well and no deterrent for behaving however you feel like behaving. It starts with little things like kids not giving up their seat on the bus to elderly passengers. There's no respect for other people's property.... for other people full stop! And if anyone complains, they face retaliation. I told off a gang of teenagers outside our house and got the house egged as a result. Luckily they seem to have grown bored of hanging out on our corner now, but it felt like running the gauntlet every time we went in or out when they were around - and this is a nice district. I don't know what the answer is, but I hope these antisocial behaviour orders begin to have some effect.

[noel]

You're right Linda not everything is doom and gloom. Having suffered depression some years ago I find myself slipping back sometimes, I'm sorry. Hearing some of the language the youngsters use is enough. I sat on a bench today outside the market hall, some young girls, 13 years old maybe sat down 10 yards away, the one sat at the end didn't seem capable of constructing a sentence without an expletive. I just think why the hell should we have to put up with it.

[LDunlop76]

quote:

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Originally posted by noel
the one sat at the end didn't seem capable of constructing a sentence without an expletive. I just think why the hell should we have to put up with it.

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I blame the bleep bleeping parents![]

[William R]

Hi Linda, I may be very much alone here, but I blame the Americanisation of our television, with their trashy cartoon programmes directed at schoolchildren when they are getting ready to go to school. My daughters two youngest, demand that the TV is on for breakfast, the content of which is to me, undesirable. Blame the parents? Hardly, what they hear as they go to school with their "friends" makes you wish you`d let them watch TV instead. Remonstrate with the parents, then you you will hear words you did not even think about, directed at you, take any action and they tell you they know where you live. An answer? Restrict the hours of television broadcasting, get as far away from American TV as we can. And listen to the howls of dismay. We managed before TV came. Kids didn`t use obscene words, the Headmaster`s word was law, and yes, I`m in favopur corporal punishment of offenders. And to Protect Martin and the Forum, this can only be my opinion. Bill.

[Martin]

I watched a tv programme a few weeks ago and I couldn't believe what I was seeing. It was about a family who had to give up their mobile phones for a week. They actually made a documentary about this! This sad bunch ended up at each others throats because they couldn't text each other for just one week. I wouldn't say that the programme made me feel old though, it just brought home to me that I appreciate what I have more than a lot of people these days.

[rocketmanjohn]

Just how can American TV programmes [ and yes, they are utter garbage, I agree] cause the problems in England? My home town is about the size of Preston. No gangs, no vandalism, no race riots, no intimidation. The worst I've seen is the occasional tree wrapped with toilet paper at graduation time. I don't know anyone with burgler alarms either.
Lack of parental control and discipline is the root cause, not TV. We all used to watch cowboys, the 3 stooges etc. but that did'nt turn us into the morons we see today.
John

[Spitfire]

John, I couldn`t agree more with what you say. The root cause is parents, parents, parents - coupled with these misguided do-gooders who think that any type of punishment is wrong.
I try to keep positive about these things but when you hear young parents shouting four letter words at their young children, what hope have they (the children) got when they grow up if they think these things are the norm. It isn`t all that long ago that swearing in the street was a criminal offence!!!!